Interview with Jenny Eclair

What an absolute hoot. It’s a lovely line-up.

It is a good line-up; it’s an absolute treat. I’d met Mae once before, in Melbourne, when we were both doing the comedy festival. We were both younger than we are now. Mae was really young – foetally young – but I remember seeing them have breakfast and thinking, “What a gorgeous creature.” I’d never met Kiell before, he’s hilarious and much more capable than he occasionally seems, particularly in throwing tasks. Ivo is a poppet, he was at university with my daughter and they have mutual friends, but I’d never met him. Frankie, our paths have crossed, but never to a point where we’ve been stuck in a corner talking to each other so that was an absolute joy. There’s a real light side to Frankie, and when you hear him giggle it’s very fun. If you say something that makes him laugh, and you get that giggle, it’s really satisfying. I thought he’d be more intense.

He also thought you were going to be a bit more serious. And you’ve both found each other to be quite joyous.

I don’t know where he got that impression from but I’ve long been associated with Grumpy Old Women which actually was never about sitting there moaning. The television series was slightly more like that but the live shows were definitely not. We all make assumptions about people.

Were you competitive?

What happens with me is that I start really well, I fly very high, and then I do an Icarus and I crash to the ground. That has been the story of my life, my career, every single thing that I’ve ever done. I make a superhuman effort and do really well, then everything crumbles.

The truth is, I’ve been waiting 15 series to get on this show and you can imagine how begging my emails became over the years, and then I got really resentful that I wasn’t asked to go on it so I didn’t watch it for ages and ages, because I don’t watch programmes I’m not invited onto that I should be invited on to, which means I’ve never ever watched a single episode of Have I Got News for You, or many other fucking things. So then, when my manager said, “We’ve got you on Taskmaster,” I was absolutely overjoyed. Then I started watching it properly, and I thought, “Fucking hell, what have I got myself into? This is really fucking big.” It’s quite a monster task all in all, and physically and mentally draining.

Why did you want to do it so badly?

Because I saw my peers doing it and I thought, “Well, why haven’t I been invited to do this?” And it had a reputation for being really, really good fun.

Did you ask anyone for advice or tips beforehand?

No, I’m not like a baby [laughs]. No, I could tell people were having a good time.

Did you have any strategy?

No, I forgot. I forgot to have a strategy. It would have been better if I had, I think. But a strategy should always be “take it slowly” whereas I just did everything like a bull in a china shop because I thought, “If I do it quick they might not notice I’ve done it wrong.”

You clearly really enjoyed it. Is it a bit like returning to childhood?

I think so. I had a similar childhood. I was brought up abroad and we didn’t have television, so there was a lot of mucking about. I had a very mucking about childhood. So yes, you’ve actually hit the nail on the head. It is a total regression.

And have you learned anything about yourself?

Yes. That I’m incredibly stupid, naive, trusting and clumsy. And too quick to act and too slow to think. That’s what I’ve learned.

Any regrets, then?

I wish I had thought more about the prize tasks, because I was mortified on a couple of occasions. But no real regrets. I wish I hadn’t taken my shoe off without having any nail varnish on my toes in episode four. And I am very double-chinned, and I forgot about that. And I wish I could do some of the tasks again, knowing what I know now.

You were accused of emotional blackmail in a bid for points by bringing up stories about your family. Is that a fair accusation?

Yes, and I wish I’d done it more. Greg liked the story about my dad being a spy. I don’t think the story about my grandson got enough points, though. I’m not sure we’ll ever break that news to Arlo that he only scored a measly two points in that round, that it didn’t tug hard enough on Greg’s heartstrings.

How did you get on with Greg generally?

I recognise a very, very common streak of comedy in what Greg does and I adore the relationship he has with Alex. It really makes me laugh; I’ve become hysterical on occasion. I once saw his live show called The Back of my Mum’s Head, where I was almost incontinent with laughter. I went with my daughter, and it was in a small sweaty attic room in Edinburgh. We were sitting next to a boy who had never seen stand-up before and afterwards, he said, “Is it always like this?” and I had to say no. It was so special for him, he was wet with laughter. I had to say, “No, sometimes it’s shit. Come and see me tomorrow night.”

How do you describe the relationship between Greg and Alex?

Absolutely adorable. It’s a much more interesting Ant and Dec. And I love Ant and Dec. I’ve worked with them a lot and they’re great. But they’re not a patch on Greg and Alex, are they?

How do you describe your relationship with Alex during the actual tasks?

I felt sometimes that he felt very sorry for me but was trying not to show it. He wasn’t as helpful as he could have been. He could have saved my bacon on a couple of occasions. He gave me the impression that I was allowed to do things that I actually wasn’t. The thing is, in the studio, you know very well it’s not your show. It’s Alex and Greg that the audience have come to see. We are mere courtiers really, in the palace of. So it is quite nerve wracking, being in the studio. There’s a tension amongst us all. We want to do well, we want to be supportive of each other, but we also want to be funny, and sometimes you feel a bit clumsy.

You have to leave your dignity at home on Taskmaster, don’t you?

I’ve never had much dignity, and what little dignity I did have disappeared a very, very long time ago. I’ve done a lot of things I should have died of shame of over the years, and I’ve managed to survive. But that has helped. I don’t think you can have vanity and be funny unless you use vanity as the core to your comedy.

Was there any particular moment where you caught yourself in the middle of doing the task and thought, “What are we even doing here?”

There is one that has prompted me to write letters of apology to my family for being so stupid. It’s a history thing and I really, really showed what my teachers always wrote in my school reports, which is “doesn’t listen, doesn’t concentrate, waste of brain” and all this kind of thing. I really live up to everything my teachers said in my school reports. It’s the one that I really cringe about.

Kiell Smith-Bynoe

Why did you say yes to Taskmaster?

If I wasn’t asked within the next two years, I would have set fire to the Taskmaster house. I realised that all of the non-creators of Ghosts have done it – Lolly [Adefope], Katy [Wix] and Charlotte [Ritchie] – so I was like, “Excuse me, why is my phone not ringing?” I was desperate to do it. I don’t really love being myself on TV. I don’t think it’s my strong point – I’m an actor first and foremost, and I play characters – but this is one of the very few things that I really, really wanted to do. I wanted to do Catchphrase and I did that, and I wanted to do this and now I’ve done that. I’m sorted now.

So we’re not going to see you on Strictly or Celebrity MasterChef, then?

Not for me, really. No matter how much my mum wants me to go on Strictly. I’m sorry, Mum, but I don’t think I will be doing the jive any time soon.

Did you talk to any previous Taskmaster contestants about it?

I spoke to Guz Khan about it. Guz doesn’t really get excited by anything. He’s equally happy being the main person in the biggest show of all time as he would chilling at home watching TV. But he was like, “Bruh, you’re gonna smash it. You’ve got to do it.” I told Katy because we were filming when I found out I was going to do it, and all she said was, “Of course.” Charlotte came to watch me in the studio record. She’s like me: as an actor, you sometimes don’t really want to see yourself in that scenario, especially with a bunch of comedians. It can be daunting, and you worry whether you haven’t said enough, or you’ve said too much.

Have you learned anything about yourself?

I don’t think I knew I was that childlike. I knew I was silly, but watching it back I’m like, “That’s a small boy.”

I particularly enjoyed your reaction whenever you first heard the task. There’s always a real confusion.

When things sound too easy I think, “That’s got to be a trick.” But also if things are really complicated, I’m like, “Why has that been written like that?” It’s harder than you think. There’s one where, without giving too much away, there were probably about four different ways I could have fucked it up and I did all four. Actually, I probably did five. And also, how close I was to actually getting it right is really annoying.

Are you a competitive person?

A lot of people came in this like, “I’ve come here to win a trophy.” I said, “I don’t care about the trophy, I just want people to say ‘Kiell won Taskmaster’ one time. That’s all I care about.” I went in there going, “I’m going to fight for everything. I want to win.”

It started to get backstabby in the studio in the final episodes.

Yes. I think it was a really great dynamic for this group. Congrats to the guys for putting this team together. The dynamic was really funny. Frankie didn’t give a shit, he’s hilarious, but he did sometimes stir the pot for fun. Jenny was very comfortable, Mae and Ivo were the most competitive.

What surprised you most about the other contestants?

I’ve met Ivo a few times but this is definitely the longest time I’ve spent with him. He’s a very funny boy. His structuring of a joke is like working backwards. It’s like in an exam where you’ve got to show your working. I can’t even think like that. But he was loads of fun. Frankie, I didn’t know what to expect either. I was actually blown away by how funny he was whilst also not caring. It was like he thinks in a slightly different way to everyone else. I was really in awe of his ability to sit in his own thoughts; not on his phone, not reading a book, not watching anything, just sitting and observing the room – and sometimes not even that. I can last about three and a half minutes before I need to be on Twitter. I’m really impressed by it. It makes me want to try it out.

I want to take Jenny home. We had such a laugh. If the house next door to mine comes available, I’ll buy it for her, just so she could live next door. Mae I know quite well; we’ve done various improv shows together. When I was doing my show at the Soho Theatre, Mae was on before me so I’d see them every day and I knew what they were going to be like – I expected an element of competition. Mae has an Escape Room brain, and that is what I don’t have. At all. I’m going to name drop a little bit. it’s not a great one, but I once did a show with Noel Edmonds, and he told us about pranks that he used to do in the eighties. Obviously, he had a lot of money in the eighties so he was able to pay for some quite elaborate pranks. He went on a stag do and he paid a bricklayer to build a brick wall outside of the best man’s hotel room, so he’d open his door to a brick wall. I wanted to do that to Mae.

What was your tactic with Greg in the studio and trying to win a few extra points?

Greg was really annoying but I did try to convince him. Every now and then I was surprised by thinking that Greg was going to absolutely hate something, then he loved it, and vice versa, so I felt it was always worth having that conversation. Sometimes it would be going in my favour and Alex would pipe up like, “Ah, but what about…” Shut up, Alex, I’m chasing victory.

Was Alex helpful on the actual tasks?

He was at first, but then I felt he turned against me. He could be a master of destruction.

Is it true that you invented the term “Platty Jubes” for the Platinum Jubilee?

That’s correct. I was thinking about that during filming because Greg used the phrase and I said, “You owe me £50, that’s my copyright”. I got nothing for coming up with that. I didn’t get an endorsement deal. I didn’t get lifted up by the England team. Nothing. I want a Gregg’s black card. I want Jubilee sausage rolls for life.

Have you thought about a name for the King’s Coronation? Because you are clearly in charge of naming royal stuff now.

Hmm, the Coronation, eh? That’s interesting. Charlie’s Corrie. That’s a working title. Let me think about that one.

Does it feel like life has changed a lot in the last couple of years as Ghosts has grown and grown?

Firstly, I think Charlotte Ritchie should get a Bafta. Her performance is incredible in this show, and what she’s doing is brilliant. She’s a horrible person [laughs], but her performance is fantastic and I think she needs to get something for that. It’s a people’s favourite, but in terms of accolades and stuff, it hasn’t really done as much as it deserves because it’s a good show, it’s funny, it makes you laugh, makes you cry, it makes you think. It’s relatable – there’s at least one character that you can be like, “Oh, that reminds me of…” And it’s very rare to make a show like that, that can be enjoyed by all ages and that can move you. I think it’s been a bit underappreciated by the industry. Not by the fans, because the fans love it.

Mae Martin

Why did you sign up for Taskmaster?

I’ve seen every episode, and I’m a big fan of tasks in general. I like problem solving; I spend most of my time in Escape Rooms. I wish that my life was just people giving me specific tasks to do. I like having choice and free will taken out of my life so I’ve been trying to get on Taskmaster for years. Every year, I literally begged them.

Why has it taken them so long to get you on?

Oh, there’s a long list of people desperate to do it, because everyone I know who’s done it has said the same thing: that it’s the most fun, and the best job, and the crew is so nice. So everyone’s desperate to do it. The format is bulletproof so in a way it doesn’t matter who’s on it, it’s always amazing because Greg and Alex are brilliant.

What did you think of your fellow contestants?

We’re super different but we did genuinely get on, even though we were at each other’s throats. There was a mutual respect! I loved sitting next to Kiell the whole time in the studio, he is hilarious. And I loved getting to know Jenny. Her laugh is so contagious and joyous, she made me laugh a lot. Ivo I’ve known for years, and Taskmaster is just the perfect format for his brain. He’s so verbose that he could take a mad task about an egg and distil it into some beautifully constructed aphorism about life. I don’t have that skill. It threw me into a bit of an existential crisis actually. Like, what is my comedic persona? I don’t have an angle. I was basically just trying really hard and really really cared about the tasks and forgot to be funny. I guess that’s my angle. I’d never met Frankie before. I knew all about him and didn’t know what to expect, but I was really pleasantly surprised. He was so lovely. I loved his dry, acerbic wit. There were these moments of real warmth and sweetness that were really nice when he got giggly.

Did you learn anything about yourself?

I learned that in that navy tracksuit I look like Judi Dench if she was eight years old. I wish I hadn’t worn that tracksuit. That’s my main thing. I could have worn literally anything else and that's what I chose? I thought I would look like some kind of cool American boy, but no. It’s really, really intense having to watch yourself. I’ve never watched myself doing stand-up – I can’t handle it. On Feel Good I was in the edit, so I had to get over myself but at least with that I had some kind of control over it. With Taskmaster, I had none. That was probably a good thing because I’d have just picked shots where my hair looks good.

You seemed quite calm.

Really?! That’s so crazy – I did not feel calm. I felt deeply panicked. Greg said I had poise, which was nice. I find Greg unbelievably magnetic. I don’t know what it is. I’ve met so many people in my life doing comedy, and I’ve never been more starstruck. For some reason, it’s like he’s the most famous man on earth in my heart. I think I just fancy him. People warned me about that. They said, “You’re going to be shocked by how fanciable Greg is.” And they weren’t lying. It’s because he’s so lovely. And it’s how quick they both are. And they’re so in tune with each other, it’s joyful. And so British.

They’re both very observant, aren’t they?

They're good at cutting right to your core with an off-hand remark. I think we’re all probably low-level narcissists, so when someone really incisively sums you up – I mean, any attention is always attractive – you’re like, “You’ve really seen me.” That’s very intoxicating. You’re like, “What else? Tell me more about me.”

Did you have a tactic when it came to dealing with Greg in the studio and trying to win him over?

I didn’t try as hard as Kiell or Ivo. I was happy to accept a loss. There were a few prize tasks where I got really shocked at the points given out, but it’s subjective, isn’t it? I knew going into it that you had to defer to his personal taste, and I knew arguing wasn’t going to get me anywhere, but maybe I thought “If I don’t push it, then maybe he’ll remember that he shafted me and he’ll pay me back. He’ll be more magnanimous.” That never happened.

How useful or not did you find Alex on the tasks?

When he says, “All the information’s on the task,” you want to chop his limbs off. Aside from that, I found him extremely charming. As a North American, I felt like I was in a Roald Dahl book. It’s so quintessentially English that I was just automatically charmed by it.

Why do you think it’s so English?

It’s the whimsy. It’s his word play, and the surrealness of it. And just the total silliness. It’s so nice for me. I’d just come off doing Feel Good, which was a hyper-personal comedy drama, you know, trauma parade. This experience was absolutely the antithesis to that, in the best way.

We should talk about Feel Good. Does it feel like things have changed a lot for you in the last couple of years? It’s done so phenomenally well.

Thanks. Yes, it came out during lockdown, so it could have done well or not, but now we’re out of lockdown that has been super nice. Even if 50 people really connected to it, that would have been nice, but it’s been great. I’m living in the States now, so it’s nice to come back for this and see my pals.

What do people say to you about it? People really connected with it.

Because it’s so personal, it opens the door to really deep personal conversations with strangers so there are a lot of people telling me about their addictions and their families and their relationships and sexuality and gender. There’s no small talk, people get right to the deep stuff, which I love. I hate small talk, so I’m happy to delve right in. And people really feel like they know me. And annoyingly, they do.

No regrets about that, though?

Nah! I also get a lot of, “What does Charlotte Ritchie smell like? What’s Charlotte Ritchie like?” She’s England’s rose. She came to watch the Taskmaster filming too, which was really nice. Kiell and I felt like we had our parents coming in to visit us.

Do you get competitive with each other over Charlotte though?

Over her attention? Sure. Alex asked her in front of us which of us was her favourite, and time froze. We all went silent. She said, “I can’t answer that.” She was very diplomatic.

Had you and Kiell met before?

Yes. Kiell and I do improv together and are pals but we both genuinely care about the integrity of the Taskmaster format, so we were really good about not discussing what tasks we’d done or anything like that. The impulse didn’t even cross my mind. I really didn’t want to. 

But you both became increasingly competitive.

Yes, well, he was seething a lot of the time. Absolutely seething. I also really wanted to win but I also have a lot of self-loathing, so I was also like, “Will people hate me if I win? Maybe I shouldn't win”...  I’d rather be liked than win, so it was a constant internal battle. But the winner gets to come back for Champion of Champions, so that’s the dream.

Were you surprised by the levels of competitiveness?

Oh, yes. I went into it thinking, “Don’t worry about anyone else, just focus on yourself.” But when you feel like someone has transgressed some rule or something, it’s so hard not to call them out, and then you feel like you’re ten years old. I know the worst thing in the world to be is a snitch, but you’ve GOT to get those points.

You have to leave your dignity and your vanity at home for this show.

I definitely had an out of body thing, thinking, “What am I doing?” because I am generally quite an inhibited person. I am quite shy and self-conscious about my hair and my appearance and stuff. So that was like exposure therapy, having to sit and watch yourself on the big screen as you try to peel an egg with your disgusting, pale, bare feet. People will take freeze frames of my fucking feet and mock me.

No regrets?

No, not at all. It’s also my dad’s favourite show. He was obsessed with Charlotte’s season. He watches it all from Canada, so I know that he’s gonna really enjoy it. It’s totally his type of thing. One of my prize tasks was something that my dad made. He spent months on it, to be honest. I can't wait for people to see it.

Read interviews with Frankie Boyle and Ivo Graham here.

Taskmaster returns on Thursday, March 30 at 9pm, C4.Interview supplied by C4.

Picture: Avalon